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	<title>Comments on: One more bike, no fewer cars?</title>
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	<link>http://treadly.net/2007/10/08/one-more-bike-no-fewer-cars/</link>
	<description>Work is just something I do between bike rides</description>
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		<title>By: Treadly and Me</title>
		<link>http://treadly.net/2007/10/08/one-more-bike-no-fewer-cars/comment-page-1/#comment-1007</link>
		<dc:creator>Treadly and Me</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Oct 2007 03:33:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://treadly.net/2007/10/08/one-more-bike-no-fewer-cars/#comment-1007</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I reckon I&#039;ll go with &lt;a href=&quot;http://deadlionsbikeblog.blogspot.com/2007/10/quiet-week-middle-class-inner-urbanites.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;deadlion&lt;/a&gt; again on that:&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;blockquote&gt;
  &lt;p&gt;I&#039;d be happy if my superannuation increased 30%, and it somehow seems counter-intuitive to be lamenting a similar increase in cycle commuters, where-ever they come from.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/blockquote&gt;

&lt;p&gt;It would be amazing if we reached 10% of trips by bike. It&#039;s not impossible, but it&#039;s not going to happen in the space of a year. As I said, credit where it&#039;s due: the trend is heading in that direction.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I reckon I&#8217;ll go with <a href="http://deadlionsbikeblog.blogspot.com/2007/10/quiet-week-middle-class-inner-urbanites.html" rel="nofollow">deadlion</a> again on that:</p>

<blockquote>
  <p>I&#8217;d be happy if my superannuation increased 30%, and it somehow seems counter-intuitive to be lamenting a similar increase in cycle commuters, where-ever they come from.</p>
</blockquote>

<p>It would be amazing if we reached 10% of trips by bike. It&#8217;s not impossible, but it&#8217;s not going to happen in the space of a year. As I said, credit where it&#8217;s due: the trend is heading in that direction.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Rob</title>
		<link>http://treadly.net/2007/10/08/one-more-bike-no-fewer-cars/comment-page-1/#comment-1008</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Oct 2007 01:49:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://treadly.net/2007/10/08/one-more-bike-no-fewer-cars/#comment-1008</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;The obvious change since 1951 has been the number of cars per household, which increases access to motorised vehicles as convenient non-considered choice for short trips and commutes and reduces dependance on Urban and inter-urban public transport.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;That sad situation, plus the overcrowding and timetable disruption that PT experiences in these days of low capital outlay (by managers and governments alike on PT) and over reliance on PPPs for capital outlay for infrastructure. This has directly exacerbated the drive for tollways, (PPP carnivores looking at the low hanging fruit of tollways ) to deliver a means to encourage the breeding programme for more motorised vehicle trips.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Cities have to take the initiative and ban private cars in CBDs and at the same time urban transport hubs need to change their focus from being poor cousins on the path to the CBD to be major destinations offering effective parking and node solutions for commuters and shoppers, especially to provide for those riding, with better bike storage/security and access facilties to widen the net.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;The solution, not freeways, tollways or more roads and cars. The solution is better planned public transport and  urban facilities solutions to encourage less use of cars and more use of PT, walking and bicycles. Paul Mees might just use some of his so called &quot;influence&quot; to push for that,  rather than being the lacky of the meedya when it suits them.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The obvious change since 1951 has been the number of cars per household, which increases access to motorised vehicles as convenient non-considered choice for short trips and commutes and reduces dependance on Urban and inter-urban public transport.</p>

<p>That sad situation, plus the overcrowding and timetable disruption that PT experiences in these days of low capital outlay (by managers and governments alike on PT) and over reliance on PPPs for capital outlay for infrastructure. This has directly exacerbated the drive for tollways, (PPP carnivores looking at the low hanging fruit of tollways ) to deliver a means to encourage the breeding programme for more motorised vehicle trips.</p>

<p>Cities have to take the initiative and ban private cars in CBDs and at the same time urban transport hubs need to change their focus from being poor cousins on the path to the CBD to be major destinations offering effective parking and node solutions for commuters and shoppers, especially to provide for those riding, with better bike storage/security and access facilties to widen the net.</p>

<p>The solution, not freeways, tollways or more roads and cars. The solution is better planned public transport and  urban facilities solutions to encourage less use of cars and more use of PT, walking and bicycles. Paul Mees might just use some of his so called &#8220;influence&#8221; to push for that,  rather than being the lacky of the meedya when it suits them.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Treadly and Me</title>
		<link>http://treadly.net/2007/10/08/one-more-bike-no-fewer-cars/comment-page-1/#comment-1009</link>
		<dc:creator>Treadly and Me</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Oct 2007 23:49:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://treadly.net/2007/10/08/one-more-bike-no-fewer-cars/#comment-1009</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;The simplest cloth-eared syllogism causes me to flounder&#8212;not exactly my best piece of analysis. Eh, what can you expect from a lunchtime rush job?&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;One of the key points that just about everyone (except me) has already raised is the knock-on effect of getting people off public transport onto bikes. &lt;a href=&quot;http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/cm-melb/message/8952&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Scott Ratcliff&lt;/a&gt; and &lt;a href=&quot;http://pedaller.blogspot.com/2007/10/6000-more-melbourne-commuting-cyclists.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;pedaller&lt;/a&gt; both mention it, but I&#039;ll go with &lt;a href=&quot;http://deadlionsbikeblog.blogspot.com/2007/10/quiet-week-middle-class-inner-urbanites.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;deadlion&lt;/a&gt;:&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;blockquote&gt;
  &lt;p&gt;many of them could have been taking public transport, which as anyone who uses public transport at peak times knows, is at or beyond capacity. So all those people cycling are actually making space for more people to take public transport, and leave their cars at home.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/blockquote&gt;

&lt;p&gt;I think there are plenty of other things that need to be done to make public transport a more palatable option for habitual drivers, but simply freeing-up space is a big part of it.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Cyclists seem to have reacted badly to Mees&#039; comments because of the &quot;middle-class inner-urbanites&quot; crack. I thought that was a bit odd coming from someone who personifies that category (he certainly qualifies more than me on all counts!) I don&#039;t know if he meant that as disparagement, but clearly it can be (and has been) taken that way across the board.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The simplest cloth-eared syllogism causes me to flounder&mdash;not exactly my best piece of analysis. Eh, what can you expect from a lunchtime rush job?</p>

<p>One of the key points that just about everyone (except me) has already raised is the knock-on effect of getting people off public transport onto bikes. <a href="http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/cm-melb/message/8952" rel="nofollow">Scott Ratcliff</a> and <a href="http://pedaller.blogspot.com/2007/10/6000-more-melbourne-commuting-cyclists.html" rel="nofollow">pedaller</a> both mention it, but I&#8217;ll go with <a href="http://deadlionsbikeblog.blogspot.com/2007/10/quiet-week-middle-class-inner-urbanites.html" rel="nofollow">deadlion</a>:</p>

<blockquote>
  <p>many of them could have been taking public transport, which as anyone who uses public transport at peak times knows, is at or beyond capacity. So all those people cycling are actually making space for more people to take public transport, and leave their cars at home.</p>
</blockquote>

<p>I think there are plenty of other things that need to be done to make public transport a more palatable option for habitual drivers, but simply freeing-up space is a big part of it.</p>

<p>Cyclists seem to have reacted badly to Mees&#8217; comments because of the &#8220;middle-class inner-urbanites&#8221; crack. I thought that was a bit odd coming from someone who personifies that category (he certainly qualifies more than me on all counts!) I don&#8217;t know if he meant that as disparagement, but clearly it can be (and has been) taken that way across the board.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Adrian</title>
		<link>http://treadly.net/2007/10/08/one-more-bike-no-fewer-cars/comment-page-1/#comment-1011</link>
		<dc:creator>Adrian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Oct 2007 09:17:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://treadly.net/2007/10/08/one-more-bike-no-fewer-cars/#comment-1011</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I disagree with Mees, even though I&#039;ve meet him, read his books and I have huge respect for his political commitment to public transport. However, playing the &quot;yuppie middle class cyclist&quot; card is a really dumb way of framing the problem because it alienates many people from the potential that cycling offers  the whole of the city.  Cycling needs to be promoted as a much more mainstream activity and while I&#039;d love to have a much better train system all over the city (i.e. in Sydney!!!!) there is no reason why cycling a transport solution in suburbs that are not in the inner city. Mees finds a strong correlation between cyclists and the inner city residents, and they&#039;re may be many reasons for this (trendy environmentalism etc), but I think we are seeing a much more wider renaissance in cycling from all sorts of people.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I disagree with Mees, even though I&#8217;ve meet him, read his books and I have huge respect for his political commitment to public transport. However, playing the &#8220;yuppie middle class cyclist&#8221; card is a really dumb way of framing the problem because it alienates many people from the potential that cycling offers  the whole of the city.  Cycling needs to be promoted as a much more mainstream activity and while I&#8217;d love to have a much better train system all over the city (i.e. in Sydney!!!!) there is no reason why cycling a transport solution in suburbs that are not in the inner city. Mees finds a strong correlation between cyclists and the inner city residents, and they&#8217;re may be many reasons for this (trendy environmentalism etc), but I think we are seeing a much more wider renaissance in cycling from all sorts of people.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: cfsmtb</title>
		<link>http://treadly.net/2007/10/08/one-more-bike-no-fewer-cars/comment-page-1/#comment-1010</link>
		<dc:creator>cfsmtb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Oct 2007 05:29:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://treadly.net/2007/10/08/one-more-bike-no-fewer-cars/#comment-1010</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;It&#039;s a discussion whose expiry date has long since past, I&#039;ve commented upon what The Age apparently reported over on my blog as so has &lt;a href=&quot;http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/cm-melb/message/8952&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Scotty&lt;/a&gt; and &lt;a href=&quot;http://lisacrowlie.blogspot.com/2007/10/riding-to-work.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Crowlie&lt;/a&gt;.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;For better outcomes for integrated, sustainable transport options, Mees could learn to get over himself and instead take heed of Peter Newman and John Pucher.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s a discussion whose expiry date has long since past, I&#8217;ve commented upon what The Age apparently reported over on my blog as so has <a href="http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/cm-melb/message/8952" rel="nofollow">Scotty</a> and <a href="http://lisacrowlie.blogspot.com/2007/10/riding-to-work.html" rel="nofollow">Crowlie</a>.</p>

<p>For better outcomes for integrated, sustainable transport options, Mees could learn to get over himself and instead take heed of Peter Newman and John Pucher.</p>]]></content:encoded>
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